The House just voted to hold Attorney General William Barr and former White House Counsel Don McGahn in civil contempt

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  • AutoModerator
    3 Month(s) Ago

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  • Lionel_Hutz_Law
    3 Month(s) Ago

    A civil contempt resolution is different from criminal contempt of Congress, which can result in lofty fines or even jail time.

    Ouch. Doesn't appear they had a lawyer proofread this before publishing it.

    Both civil and criminal contempt can get you thrown in a cell.

    We don't want criminal contempt here. We want civil contempt. Criminal contempt can be pardoned. Civil cannot.

    With civil contempt you are said to "hold the keys to your own jail cell". Comply with the subpoena or other lawful order, and you're released. Don't comply, and you get to sit there until you do.

    Criminal contempt requires a criminal trial with full blown criminal constitutional protections. And if convicted, then you're sentenced for a set period of time. That's not what we're going for here. We want them to be forced to comply with Congress' subpoena.

  • PutinsPawn
    3 Month(s) Ago

    A couple extra pieces of information from the New York Times:

    Tuesday’s resolution also gives Mr. Nadler the authority to petition a federal judge for access to secretive grand jury material amassed in the course of Mr. Mueller’s investigation. Such information rarely becomes public, but Mr. Nadler has made the case that his committee needs access to it to determine whether impeachment is warranted. His efforts to persuade the Justice Department to join him in making the request were rebuffed.

    And Bloomberg:

    It permits a number of committee chairmen to bypass future floor votes in order to file additional lawsuits in their probes, ratcheting up the constitutional showdown between the House and a president who has vowed that “we’re fighting all the subpoenas.”

    Judiciary Committee Chairman Jerrold Nadler wouldn’t say Tuesday when he might go to court to seek enforcement of subpoenas against McGahn or Barr.

    “When a congressional committee issues a subpoena, compliance is not optional,” Nadler said on the House floor. “We have never faced such blanket stonewallings.”

  • D1T1A
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Honestly, the one positive I can take from the political shitstorms on both sides of the Atlantic, is that I’m learning so much about the legal and political systems of both countries. The downside of that though is that it gives a real insight into just how cumbersome and broken they are.

  • channel_12
    3 Month(s) Ago

    "The 229-191 vote fell straight along party lines".

    Amash--a nay voter. Hmmm.

  • [deleted]
    3 Month(s) Ago


  • cohumanize
    3 Month(s) Ago

    barr's all-in, but mcgahn's not, so might be worth looking to the latter more

  • Frying_Dutchman
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Fuck yea! Thank god we got the Dems in power in half of one branch. Let’s finish the job in 2020!

  • AssicusCatticus
    3 Month(s) Ago

    My Rep voted against it, of course. Thanks, McKinley, you piece of Trump-sucking trash.

  • NormP
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Would be nice to see them do this to Mnuchin too.

  • Riversmooth
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Trump said if you I vote for Hillary, "there would be endless investigations". I did - and he was right.

  • blazera
    3 Month(s) Ago

    If we ever get around to a government term that starts fixing things, might I suggest changing the system where a position appointed by the president is tasked with stopping the president from doing corrupt illegal things?

  • Seanay-B
    3 Month(s) Ago

    This ought to be a bigger story than Jon Stewart lighting up congressmen that aren't even there

  • Rivercity76
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Republicans in here completely defending this guy when everyone else see's him for what he is, GOP you are really embarrassing yourselves

    I feel like if someone said trump had a small dick his supporters would go ape shit and be like "NAH UHH HE HAS BIG PENIS"...

  • umblegar
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Barr looks like the kind of guy that borrows your PS2 and then claims it was his all along.

  • Sanhael
    3 Month(s) Ago

    I used to work for a gas station. A drunk guy was arrested, and prosecuted, for stealing a $1.29 package of doughnuts. Another employer, a convenience store, asked me to be a witness in the trial of a former employee who stole $25 in lottery tickets. It's good to know that when the attorney general, literally the chief law enforcement official in the country, commits crimes that affect the welfare of hundreds of millions of people directly, some watchful agency is keeping a close eye, ready and willing to consider advocating for the possibility of setting up a meeting to potentially discuss maybe initiating the process of preparing to hold the man semi-accountable.

    Maybe the attorney general should wear a body camera.

  • ZephkielAU
    3 Month(s) Ago

    I really, really want to know how somebody is so openly disloyal and will throw anybody under the bus where convenient (Trump) inspires such loyalty from everyone who enters his orbit.

    For all my years of watching politics from across the ocean, I've never seen such absolute loyalty for anyone, and Trump is the last person I expected to inspire it.

    People are risking not only their careers but potentially their freedoms, reputations and/or lives outside of a jail cell to unflinchingly and unreservedly protect a reality TV star/"business mogul" and I can't for the life of me figure out why. What's the missing piece?

    Is Trump actually a genius? Has he 'Game of Thrones'd all this shit to make an impenetrable shield of underlings?

    I want to know who has what on who so I can figure out what the fuck is going on in this timeline.

  • paperbackgarbage
    3 Month(s) Ago



    This is just one more step in the eventual culmination of the subpoenaed documents/interviews being decided in court.

    Remember the subpoenaed documents/interviews? That's what was requested in the first place.

    Jesus. I hope that nobody jingles their car-keys in front of your face when you have important business to do.

  • arthurpenhaligon
    3 Month(s) Ago

    In case anyone was wondering - the vote was completely party line. All Democrats for and all Republicans against (including Justin Amash despite his big talk about Barr's unethical conduct and Trump's impeachable offense).

    With rare exception, you can't count on "moderate" Republicans to do the right thing when it counts.

  • celicajohn1989
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Is there a link to the hearing?? I was waiting all day to watch this...

    3 Month(s) Ago

    If you are not fighting back against that corrupted system, you are part of that corrupted system.

    The whole world is watching.

  • Mersues
    3 Month(s) Ago

    But they didn't. According the the New York Times

    The resolution, which passed along party lines, 229 to 191, grants the Judiciary Committee the power to petition a federal judge to force Attorney General William P. Barr and the former White House counsel Donald F. McGahn II to comply with congressional subpoenas [...] But it stops short of holding either witness in contempt of Congress

    and further down in the article

    But there is no guarantee the courts will give them [Democrats] a useful outcome — at least not quickly. Past cases have stretched on for months or even years.

    Again, the base is calling for consequences and instead we're getting weak procedural actions wrapped in harsh words.

    This vote that simply allows lawsuits to be filed should have been taken the day Barr released his "summary" and refused to give congress the full Mueller report, not three months later.

    EDIT: To those asking what I'd like to be done instead, I would like to see the House hold Barr in inherent contempt. Inherent contempt is not pardonable and does not rely on the judicial branch.

  • prmikey
    3 Month(s) Ago

    How many damn votes does the HJC have to hold until they actually do something? Real question, despite the expressed frustration.

  • mindy2000
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Fuck Trump and all his supporting American traitors

  • Enjolras55
    3 Month(s) Ago

    So many trolls here. I guess this hit a nerve in right-wing idiot world.

  • BraveOmeter
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Barney: Finally, some action.

  • verily_i_am
    3 Month(s) Ago


  • shanster925
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Ooo this is juicy

    This saga is going to make one hell of a book in 10 years.

  • double_tripod
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Good. These bastards need to do hard time

  • djustinblake
    3 Month(s) Ago

    As they damn well should. The dems stood to lose a lot of votes with a failure to act.

  • Seniko
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Fucking deserves worse.

  • kdebones
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Now, say it with me folks. LOCK THEM UP!

  • autotldr
    3 Month(s) Ago

    This is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 88%. (I'm a bot)

    WASHINGTON - The House of Representatives voted Tuesday to allow a congressional committee to enforce subpoenas by taking uncooperative executive branch officials to court using a civil contempt resolution.

    A civil contempt resolution is different from criminal contempt of Congress, which can result in lofty fines or even jail time.

    The move comes after the House Judiciary Committee advanced contempt of Congress resolutions for both Attorney General William Barr and former White House counsel Don McGahn, marking the most severe congressional action against President Donald Trump's administration since Democrats reclaimed the chamber's majority.

    Extended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: committee#1 contempt#2 House#3 Mueller#4 case#5

  • KeystrokeCowboy
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Yeah let's see how many subpoenas democratic admin officials simply ignore and republicans let slide. Oh wait, they sued Eric Holder over a subpoena. Republicans are hypocrite pieces of shit.

  • crazy123456789009876
    3 Month(s) Ago

    Lock them up! Lock them up!